Honest Question needs Honest Answer

[Q-Unit]

I remember vividly the ridicule anyone received in the last 8 years for speaking publicly against President Bush. During the first stage of the Iraqi war and especially right after 9/11, it was very very faux pas to even say anything remotely insulting of President Bush. Of course in the last couple decades, late night TV hosts/SNL started the trend that its OK to ridicule the President, but the venom that ensued for even raising a finger against President Bush was telling of either hardcore partisan or that its "unpatriotic" to question the Commander in Chief. Now the insults are more prevalent and less stringent in light of his lame-duck status, but this begs the question:

If anyone speaks against President Obama, would any of you (or anyone for that matter) stand up for him? Whether or not you voted for him? After all he is our president. If the band Styx (from Illinois) was on tour in Europe and they publicly said they were ashamed Barack Obama is from Illinois, would they get blacklisted and called out as unpatriotic from fellow Illinois band, Chicago?
(akin to what happened to the Dixie Chicks/Toby Keith?)

Not necessarily relevant or important, but I was just curious what some responses would be.

(Personally, I'm an equal opportunity insulter lol)

No matter what, I truly hope the country turns for the better economically and socially not only for the next 4-8 years, but beyond!

[Nigel Tufnel]

Originally Posted by Q-Unit

I remember vividly the ridicule anyone received in the last 8 years for speaking publicly against President Bush.

If the band Styx (from Illinois) was on tour in Europe and they publicly said they were ashamed Barack Obama is from Illinois, would they get blacklisted and called out as unpatriotic from fellow Illinois band, Chicago?
(

Well, I try to stay out of this political stuff....but I've been drinking a few beers (I'm golfing tomorrow instead of work... ), so I thought I'd swing by here to see if HD had committed Harakiri yet....but I thought I'd respond as follows:

1) You remember the ridicule anyone received in the last 8 years for speaking out pubilcily against Bush? 2001-2004 maybe...but the last 8 years? I've heard plenty of ridicule regardless of my opinion on whether the guy was right or wrong for going to Iraq.

2) You referenced the band Styx in making a comparison to the Obama/Bush presidencies. Styx? ****in' Styx? I'm sailing away? I'm not saying your metaphor is misguided or incorrect...but you brought Styx into it....Domo Arigato, Mr. Roboto...

I've but one thing to say to you, sir....STYX...secret, secret, I've got a secret...






One may have been vehemently against Obama...anyone against Obama, I can certainly....trust me...I can certainly understand their concerns....but at this point, lets hope Obama wasn't quite as liberal as he seemed in his campaign.....I think big time politics may actually back him off of some of his more liberal positions...either way, we need to support this guy and hope for the best. He's our new president....support him or not during the election, let's give him the benefit of the doubt, cross our fingers and hope for the best.

God knows the guy has some SERIOUS problems with which to deal. (suck it, Churchill...how about not ending that sentence with a preposition?)

[Q-Unit]

Originally Posted by Nigel Tufnel

2) You referenced the band Styx in making a comparison to the Obama/Bush presidencies. Styx? ****in' Styx? I'm sailing away? I'm not saying your metaphor is misguided or incorrect...but you brought Styx into it....Domo Arigato, Mr. Roboto...

apologies, to be clear, I was comparing the ridicule the Dixie Chicks received for badmouthing President Bush in Europe. They were subsequently blacklisted from a lot of country radio stations, and their fellow country musician Toby Keith also threw them under the bus. Their comments were mostly saying they were ashamed Bush was from Texas.

For this reason alone I reference two of the more well known bands from Illinois in my analogy to President Obama.

Like I said, not totally relevant but just to support my original question.

[Nigel Tufnel]

Q, like I said in my original response, I totally understood your comparison.....I just thought Styx was a funny reference. Totally understand what you're saying. Just the thought of the story on CNN is comical:

Breaking News: posted 11 mins ago

Illinois native 70's rock band Styx was playing to a sold out Arena in Uzbekistan when lead singer, _____________ (no idea), spoke out against President Obama.


I totally get what you're saying.....just visualizing the idea is funny...hey, I said I had been drinking.

[Q-Unit]

Originally Posted by Nigel Tufnel

Q, like I said in my original response, I totally understood your comparison.....I just thought Styx was a funny reference. Totally understand what you're saying. Just the thought of the story on CNN is comical:

Breaking News: posted 11 mins ago

Illinois native 70's rock band Styx was playing to a sold out Arena in Uzbekistan when lead singer, _____________ (no idea), spoke out against President Obama.


I totally get what you're saying.....just visualizing the idea is funny...hey, I said I had been drinking.

oh ok

LOL I didnt even know Styx was still touring!

yeah thats a perfect example of doling out an analogy without extensive research (on my part) but yeah my general point was the idea that would future endeavors to discredit our new president be met with the same treatment?

But it obviously shouldnt be or was a partisan thing as Bush since 2005 and beyond, maybe 2006... has been thrown through the gauntlet in terms of ridicule.

[Rothko]

Who honestly gives a fck what the lead singer of STYX has to say!?!? hahaha

To answer your question Q...I would certainly defend Obama! I would also be quick to criticize him as well! I don't think you can vote for someone and think every decision he/she makes will be perfectly in line with every agenda! The person you vote for will not always make the right decisions (atleast not in your opinion) so you have to be fair, right!?

[Q-Unit]

Originally Posted by Rothko

Who honestly gives a fck what the lead singer of STYX has to say!?!? hahaha

To answer your question Q...I would certainly defend Obama! I would also be quick to criticize him as well! I don't think you can vote for someone and think every decision he/she makes will be perfectly in line with every agenda! The person you vote for will not always make the right decisions (atleast not in your opinion) so you have to be fair, right!?

no doubt I agree, this guy will not/should not get a free pass.

that being said, though I am/was quick to insult President Bush, there were many times I did defend him but not often anywhere from 2005-present times. I certainly think as long as he's got our best interests we should have his back, whoever the president is. Sometimes its hard with Bush because you feel like he's so detached from what this country needs, almost neglectful. Even though he could go down as one of the worse presidents, the world still did NOT end.

I honestly don't get nor care to see all the scriptures quoted by individuals suddenly springing up upon the election results, I feel like we're living in the Dark Ages and if someone could swim they are branded a witch.

Obama could very well be even worse than Bush, I would hope not but its very possible, but that DOES not mean the rapture is here! lol sorry I am not addressing anyone in particular here, but mostly its the crap I've seen on other sites.

[homedawg]

Originally Posted by Q-Unit

no doubt I agree, this guy will not/should not get a free pass.

that being said, though I am/was quick to insult President Bush, there were many times I did defend him but not often anywhere from 2005-present times. I certainly think as long as he's got our best interests we should have his back, whoever the president is. Sometimes its hard with Bush because you feel like he's so detached from what this country needs, almost neglectful. Even though he could go down as one of the worse presidents, the world still did NOT end.

I honestly don't get nor care to see all the scriptures quoted by individuals suddenly springing up upon the election results, I feel like we're living in the Dark Ages and if someone could swim they are branded a witch.

Obama could very well be even worse than Bush, I would hope not but its very possible, but that DOES not mean the rapture is here! lol sorry I am not addressing anyone in particular here, but mostly its the crap I've seen on other sites.

"You made your bed, now sleep in it!"

Understand, there were 56million+ American voters that didn't agree with you, however, they will have to live with your decision too!

[Q-Unit]

Originally Posted by homedawg

"You made your bed, now sleep in it!"

Understand, there were 56million+ American voters that didn't agree with you, however, they will have to live with your decision too!

I own my bed, its not on lease. and its very comfortable. I sleep fine at night.

Understand, there were 63million+ American voters that voted for Obama (not once have I disclosed who I voted for, I equally hold McCain and Obama to high standards as potential candidates for our presidency, so now that its Obama, so be it), however they will have to live with their decision, and they seem pretty happy with it... at least until he screws up and they turn on him like any president in American history. However I for one do not hope for this, even if it was McCain, I honestly like many others hope for the best.

50+ million people were just as elated the first time Bush won, and the 2nd time.... not so much after he's burned the bed, and subsequently sold it to China in a manner of speaking


- I appreciate the responses from Nigel and Rothko, even HD though the smart money was that he would not stand up for our new Commander-in-Chief the way I and many many many Americans did for Bush the 2nd time when he won (even if they didnt vote for him) and hoped he would finish the job he started, without leaving our country in the state it is now.

- To lose and be disappointed is one thing, and valid but the sour grapes are stank.

[dananderson32]

I sat in my house last night watching the election coverage and when they called it for Obama at 11pm ET (even though it was quite obvious Obama was gonna win far before that) to watch the people react black, white, old, young, etc......huggin, crying with each other strangers all around ...............I being a very young person never lived through the civil rights era or any of those true struggles minorities experienced in this countries history but to imagine what those people (African-Americans) felt at that moment especially those who marched with MLK jr. and others during the civil rights era is unimaginable and no matter who you voted for if that doesn't instill in you a sense of pride and that ANYTHING is possible in this great country, and how great this country is and could be in the future and how lucky we all are to have the privilege to live here then i don't know what ever will........

[Rothko]

Originally Posted by Q-Unit

However I for one do not hope for this, even if it was McCain, I honestly like many others hope for the best

...and that's what we all must hope for in this country!

I for one was very critical of W's two terms in office! I think it would be a waste of time to go back and list one by one why I think he was such a cancer to our country! It's been my opinion for a long time and although it goes against the grain in this forum I can't help but to believe we are better off without him!

Could Obama be worse than W? I highly doubt it considering how crippled our country is emotionally, financially etc... I pray that he is going to be a worthy president because I voted for him! I am going to support him completely and hope he delivers on the promise that he can change our country from its current state!

...and you can take all the religious ****, the antichrist, the rapture, the end of the world and put it in the same boat as Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny and Bigfoot because it's ludicrous, childish and pathetic! I love hearing these fanatics parlay the end of the world with Obama's election! How could anyone take them seriously??

But to comment further on Q's question, I do feel just because you voted for Obama doesn't mean he is immune from criticism...especially from you! I will be the first one here to defend AND and criticize Obama if he makes a decision I am strongly for or against! God knows he is going to be under the most intense magnifying glass in the next four years...even more than his predecessor IMHO!

Oh, by the way Q, the whole Styx/Illinois/Dixie Chicks/Toby Keith analogy was brilliant! That paragraph along should be up for a Pulitzer! LOL! Man, I love reading your posts!

[Q-Unit]

lol you give me waaay too much credit.

I just used Illinois as the premise in comparison to Texas and looked up famous bands from Illinois. It was either Styx and Chicago or Mel Torme and Chaka Khan.

[BoKnows]

Short answer yes.

The difference will be that the blame, unlike during "W" time will be placed elsewhere as Barack will be able to do no wrong and if you do criticize him you will be a racist. That is the sad and unfortunate truth as we will forever pay for what happened 400 yrs ago.

As for "W" did he make a lot of mistakes hell yes he did all Presidents do. When we look back in history what we will see is that "W" was President during one of the most difficult times in our history and he took the blame for every mistake the country made. Was this right...no, is it a fact yes.... though that did not mean **** from shinola to the masses as the liberal media painted the picture and everyone bought the painting. Look at the number 1 factor people voted for B.O...the Economy...what that means is that the gen pop believed it was Bush and the Republicans fault for the mess we are in...fact or fiction....what they believed was fact...what they believed in was fiction. Just see the post's above. It is called being naive and not truely understanding the intricate complexity of the issues. Blame is easy to put, just dont put it on Barrack or you will pay

[Nigel Tufnel]

Originally Posted by BoKnows

Short answer yes.

The difference will be that the blame, unlike during "W" time will be placed elsewhere as Barack will be able to do no wrong and if you do criticize him you will be a racist. That is the sad and unfortunate truth as we will forever pay for what happened 400 yrs ago.

As for "W" did he make a lot of mistakes hell yes he did all Presidents do. When we look back in history what we will see is that "W" was President during one of the most difficult times in our history and he took the blame for every mistake the country made. Was this right...no, is it a fact yes.... though that did not mean **** from shinola to the masses as the liberal media painted the picture and everyone bought the painting. Look at the number 1 factor people voted for B.O...the Economy...what that means is that the gen pop believed it was Bush and the Republicans fault for the mess we are in...fact or fiction....what they believed was fact...what they believed in was fiction. Just see the post's above. It is called being naive and not truely understanding the intricate complexity of the issues. Blame is easy to put, just dont put it on Barrack or you will pay

I will respectfully disagree with this, Bo. I think the guy might get some slack....but if he continually makes bad decisions and it hurts the country, I think he will get plenty of blame. Sure, some left wing nutjobs may scream racism, but I don't think it will get them very far. You may not have a lot of confidence in the majority of the American people right now being that you feel people are naive and don't understand the complexities of the issues...and you may very well be correct, but, if BO's presidency is one mistake after another and its clear that he is not doing well, I think he will, and rightfully so, be blamed and critiqued.

One thing is clear to me...I went to newspapers.com and read some newspapers from around the world the last couple of days....man, the leaders of the rest of the world are like frenzied sharks swimming in chum water.....they are already lining up for BO to keep his promises and make the entire world better. Add to that this country's economic mess....and damn, I have to wonder if BO is thinking to himself right now, "what the hell have I gotten myself into here?"

There is one undeniable pro to BO's election....regardless of whether he is the worst President in our country's history....my young children are going to grow up in a society and generation much different than mine. My children will grow up not giving a second thought to an African American President. For that reason alone, I am grateful.

[BoKnows]

Originally Posted by Nigel Tufnel

There is one undeniable pro to BO's election....regardless of whether he is the worst President in our country's history....my young children are going to grow up in a society and generation much different than mine. My children will grow up not giving a second thought to an African American President. For that reason alone, I am grateful.

First and foremost I hate racism!I consider racist to be some of the most ignorant people on the planet. I love the fact that an african american or part thereof can live the dream and be whatever they can be and therefore I am glad that an african american or part thereof has risen to the top of the political spectrum, I just wish that his platform was more inline with what I think needs to be done for our great country!So, the pro you elude to I agree with whole heartedly. Hopefully I am wrong and B.O moves towards the middle which I think needs to happen or he will commit political suicide as I believe as a country we are more middle right than far left as he has been and his platform portrays him to be.Though I do believe he will never get hammered like "W" regardless if he turns out to not be much better than Bush. He has his work cut out for him.